Directing JumpJet Flight

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	Author	Topic: Directing JumpJet Flight (Read 4061 times)

WhiteMufasa

Bondsman

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Directing JumpJet Flight

« on: February 29, 2008, 10:30:59 AM »

Hey again everyone...

I know I had made a post a while ago about DFA, and was told it would be included... i was wondering how you were going to implement directing your mech's jump path... will you just be using the standard movement buttons/controls or will there be seperate controls for directing jumpjets?


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ToeBall

Code Monkey One
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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #1 on: February 29, 2008, 11:38:03 AM »

We haven't gotten that far yet. Any suggestions?


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Arch Dreary

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #2 on: February 29, 2008, 06:29:06 PM »

I think you should use the keys that control throttle(Forward and back speed Movement) and left to right steering with your legs in order to control your jump jets, sense you can't use your legs in the air any way. I have no idea what keys you guys are going to use for the controls of turning the jump jets on or off. Depending on the mechs speed with jump jets. Throttle could control increase in speed if turned up.

I feel ignored Cry

Quote from: Arch Dreary on February 29, 2008, 05:51:34 AM

Fuel Based Jump jets would be cool.

ToeBall Can the elemental, Light, Meduim, Heavy, and Assult, have 5 Different ways of useing Jump Jets in the game?
Like the elemental would have a fast vertical take off because it's so small and light but less fuel to use.
Light would have more fuel, it would be a little bit slower then the elementals in vertical take off but can use it's jets for short term boosts of added speed, and it would have nice maneuvering speed with it's jets.
Meduim could have more fuel, would go slower in all useage of the jump jets that the light has.
Heavy could have more fuel, but it won't be able to boost speed, slower then meduim jump jet usage.
Assult could have more fuel, but it won't be able to boost speed, slower then heavy jump jet usage.
You see where i'm going with this? The more heavyer the mech gets the less maneuvering ability they get from jump jets. Too activate the speed boost of jump jets it could be a double press on the jump jets key.

In space you probaly don't have to worry about weight effecting jump jets.

I deleted some of my quote to save space. Speed Boosts arn't really needed.

This would help Light and meduim mechs to not be easy targets in the air. Sense, they rely more on there speed then there armor. The mechs that can afford getting hit would be the slower heavy and Assult mechs.
Bigger mechs would probaly use more fuel to fight gravity.


« Last Edit: February 29, 2008, 07:01:43 PM by Arch Dreary »	Logged

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Mrocz

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2008, 03:16:39 PM »

Better Idea... For Keyboard + mouse control setup jump jets controls should be like Arch Dreary said... But for Joystick Setup Jump jets should be controlled by HAT ;] What do you think?


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WhiteMufasa

Bondsman

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #4 on: March 04, 2008, 10:30:34 AM »

I preferred the MW2 way of directing jump jets- with seperate keys.

I liked this for a few reasons,
- Different mechs have jump jets in different locations and this will effect how well they controll their jumping trajectory and their ability to change directions.
- With seperate jump jet controlls their is no need to turn the jump jets on or off, you are simply engaging them to jump you in the direction you want.
- You can travel in three dimmentions when using jump jets as compared to two when running/walking... and you need controlls that will let you maximize this feature.
- There is also no throttle with jump jets. Your either firing them or not.


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ecdmuppet

Bondsman

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #5 on: March 04, 2008, 07:47:01 PM »

For directing jumpjets, it may be prudent to adopt "QWES" for the jumpjets, with A and D used to turn the legs on the ground, and spin the mech in the air. Some variation on that setup would make for familiar FPS controlls, and allow for implementation of the jump jet speed boost idea mentioned earlier (which I think is a pretty sexy idea, actually).

As far as DFA is concerned, I played Mechwarrior 2: Mercenaries online on the public servers, and I REALLY pissed people off by DFA'ing them OVER and OVER and OVER again, rather than shooting them in my 7MPLAS Excutioner(Which worked almost as well as DFA for getting kills, but produced a bit more heat). In hindsight, me, and maybe two or so other people that made a habit of this may be what got the mechanic nerfed out of MW's 3 and 4 altogether. When Jumpjets and DFA are implemented, I would urge caution. The mechanics in the MW2 series such as jump jet pulsing allowed mechs to stay airborne indefinitely, and made DFA fairly overpowered(this coming from perhaps the one guy who benefitted from it most). in MWLL, I'm hoping that you guys can reach a happy medium: where a modicum of aerial control is possible, while avoiding the pitfall of having hanggliding missileboats and DFAfests replacing the normal ground-based gameplay.

GL with the game, guys! It looks super sexy so far! I'm an ametuer 3D modeler myself, working primarily with Lightwave, and all I can say is your nurnies are sexy as hell! Wink


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Hyncharas

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2008, 12:52:08 PM »

I don't want to sound annoying but jumpjet physics was really hard for me. There was something in Crysis I liked and it was how the thrusters of a nanosuit could "powerslide" left and right using the Shift key, so what about an adaptation of that for the mod? As an example, say you want to jump over a wall. In the games what had to happen was hold down a button to keep you in the air, then another to direct where you were going...

Instead of this, what happened if you could use the mech's own inertia the same way a human does - using Alt or the Spacebar to jump when running, then; while moving in the same direction as the run, holding Shift and tap a directional key(s) to fire the jumpjets and propel the mech along another path? I think this is the way MechCommander did it with the exception that players didn't see how the computer works out how to get from A to B to C while in the air.

As for the legs, they could be programmed in the rig to adjust hydraulics so they can respond for when a) the jumpjets are fired, and b) when the mech is about to land.


« Last Edit: March 06, 2008, 12:56:56 PM by Hyncharas »	Logged

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darktimes

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2008, 01:32:40 PM »

suggestion

w = forward
s`= backward

^for normal movement and thruster air movement^

a = turn legs left / jumpjet to left
d = turn legs right / jumpjet to right

mouse = torso movement

space = jumpjet

leg position is by landing imo not necessary

easy and simple, huh?


« Last Edit: March 07, 2008, 11:22:10 AM by darktimes »	Logged

Wolf~72

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #8 on: March 08, 2008, 07:49:38 PM »

i believe the mw2 system was the best

home = thrust forward
end = thrust reverse
page down = thrust turn right
delete = thrust turn left
page up = thrust right
insert = thrust left
J = thrust up

it allowed for 'jumping' as well as control thrusts for advanced tactical maneuvers
so you could effectively strafe short distances

and it was not a tool for noobs , it took some skill to master
and then again in each mech it was differnt due to thruster placements

my brother used it particalry well if i managed to sneak up behind him, and launched a alpha at his rear
as my lasers hit he would turn 360 and face me, then before my missiles and other weapons got there
he would do some quick control thrusts and strafe out of the way of the rest of the alpha strike
then charge at me and unleash autocannon hell

his fav mech was Summoner and mine TimberWolf

this JJ system was awesome,
quite powerful
took skill to master
(ppl never even considered jump sniping till mw4 lameness)
and its a scaleable system, ie: heavier mechs use more juice than lights or they all eat it at same rate due to fuel capacity


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TimoBlastem

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #9 on: March 08, 2008, 07:58:22 PM »

The jump snipe lameness is a problem that I would like to see removed. I played MW4 MP about three times before swearing it off because of this. There was no point in equiping anything other than JJ and beam weapons, making any sort of mech tactics useless. This is also a problem in other mech combat games from what I hear.

I'm talking about the arena maps only, some of the city ones forced actual tactics.


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Hyncharas

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #10 on: March 09, 2008, 11:58:01 AM »

Quote from: TimoBlastem on March 08, 2008, 07:58:22 PM

I suppose you could make it so that mechs couldn't fire while using jumpjets, as pretty much any weapon could be considered something to snipe an enemy with based on how much armor they had left.


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Tharnow

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #11 on: March 09, 2008, 05:12:30 PM »

I would prefer a simple solution: make it harder to aim while jumping. It is rather common in shooters, and it seems appropriate for mechs, too. Jump sniping would be still possible (you are announcing it for some mechs, e.g. MadCat MKII), but way harder and less devastating, as you could hardly hit specific locations.


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ToeBall

Code Monkey One
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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2008, 06:11:38 PM »

Well, as it sit right wow, jump sniping is next to impossible. Firing weapons causes the mech to buck and move because of recoil and if you were airborne you wouldn't be able to adjust. As a result either you won't hit very hard or you won't hit very much. It's an expensive way not to do very much damage.


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MWLLKeeper

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #13 on: March 10, 2008, 07:39:09 AM »

Actually, he was talking about beam weapons which have no recoil, so his arguments still apply. HOWEVER I do plan for jumping to be far more of a violent process in itself, with a full scale JUMP animation, and a rapid flight (not the skeet shoot festival of MW jumping Cheesy

)


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Hyncharas

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Re: Directing JumpJet Flight

« Reply #14 on: March 10, 2008, 02:22:26 PM »

Hitting the Spacebar twice for a boost straight up, then using the movement keys normally for inertia might be another good idea as well. A nice thing about jumpjets for me, if nothing else, is standing on top of a building to use as an artillery or scout position.


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