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Author Topic: Legs: My obession!  (Read 1180 times)
Jdude
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« on: August 05, 2008, 04:29:56 AM »

First I'd like to say I love you guys for making this mod! Cheesy  I'm so happy it's being made Smiley

My favorite Mech game has always been MechWarrior 2.  I played it as a child and for some reason I've always thought it was extremely cool that you could blow off the mech's legs and have them limp around really slow.  I always thought that this was a good reason to invest in at least a very small jump jet so if it happens to you, you can get to your objective a bit quicker.  In the latter Mech games they replaced the blowing off of legs with a damaged leg which sparks and drags along.  I really didn't like that, in fact it almost turned me off the game completely.  Idealy I'd love to see both those damage systems implemented.  If you get your leg damaged then you may end up dragging it, however it could still get blown off and cause you to have to use your jets. 

Anyways it's just an idea, keep up the awesome work!
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Clownmite
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« Reply #1 on: August 05, 2008, 06:23:49 PM »

There was a pretty big discussion about this in another thread. Everyone has their own preferences for how legging 'mechs is handled, but in the end the LL team are going to have to do what's best for gameplay. I think the system you just described will be in the game, where enough damage to the 'mech causes it to limp, but that leg could further be destroyed. I think, however, when the leg is fully destroyed the 'mech will probably go with it.
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MWLLKeeper
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« Reply #2 on: August 06, 2008, 04:12:32 PM »

More than likely the system to be used (after playtesting and such) is to have a system where once a leg is damaged enough it begins to limp. If BOTH legs get that damaged, the mech falls over as it is no longer capable of balancing. However, once a leg is limping, it is possible to KEEP damaging it, and blow it right off. That at least, is the plan Wink
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xNeoThoRx
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« Reply #3 on: October 15, 2008, 09:21:35 PM »

There was a pretty big discussion about this in another thread. Everyone has their own preferences for how legging 'mechs is handled, but in the end the LL team are going to have to do what's best for gameplay. I think the system you just described will be in the game, where enough damage to the 'mech causes it to limp, but that leg could further be destroyed. I think, however, when the leg is fully destroyed the 'mech will probably go with it.

I would really hope that legging stays the same as it was in MW4.

I never had a problem with people legging me.. and I played against some of the best players Mech has ever seen.  I almost never had over half armor on my legs.. lol
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Spyro
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« Reply #4 on: October 15, 2008, 09:59:08 PM »

personally the legs are a mechs weakness, and also a harder spot to hit...try implementing critical hit locations...IE in a joint that is unarmored.  but also spots that are much harder than normal IE an armor plate
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DruidChiken
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« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2008, 08:42:40 PM »

Ive always thought it weird that you could kill a mech by legging it, once both legs are critted it should be disabled and unable move, but killing a mech should only be possible from head or torso shots.
« Last Edit: October 20, 2008, 08:46:02 PM by DruidChiken » Logged



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Jhereg
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« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2008, 07:04:28 AM »

The reasons that many games have the loss of a leg  result in the 'mech being destroyed is twofold.
Since the original tabletop game was based on dice and modifiers, not the players personal eye hand coordination it was very easy to "hit" a location on a 'mech which was already destroyed so in order to make the hit count.
Developers chose a damage model which had any "hit" which was located on a destroyed 'mech travel  inward to the next available target location (hit a destroyed left arm, damage would travel to left torso).

Most 'mech video games took the damage model straight from the tabletop.
The only game I know of that did it correctly with legs being damaged, destroyed and the 'mech still viable ( albeit on the ground) was Kesmai's  MultiPlayer Battletech.
On that game people still legged but that didn't stop their opponent from possibly standing on one leg  or propping with ausable arc of fire.

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xKamikazex
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« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2008, 12:16:51 PM »

I never had a problem with people legging me.. and I played against some of the best players Mech has ever seen.  I almost never had over half armor on my legs.. lol

That's because MW4 vets have hill sniping and jump sniping to an art and never expose their legs when they come up to shoot Wink. Don't worry, I was there doing it too Cheesy.
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xNeoThoRx
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« Reply #8 on: October 24, 2008, 12:04:36 PM »

I never had a problem with people legging me.. and I played against some of the best players Mech has ever seen.  I almost never had over half armor on my legs.. lol

That's because MW4 vets have hill sniping and jump sniping to an art and never expose their legs when they come up to shoot Wink. Don't worry, I was there doing it too Cheesy.

Haha Wink

Even when I played in Inner City with Daishi or Atlas.. I almost never had more than half armor on my mechs legs.

I forget what the magic number was.. I believe it was something like 1.1 or 1.5

I was very quick with my shots.. so if the person wanted to waste time shooting my leg.. So be it Smiley   They would be solid red or crit in 1 shot to the CT
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DruidChiken
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« Reply #9 on: October 24, 2008, 12:47:24 PM »

Most 'mech video games took the damage model straight from the tabletop.
The only game I know of that did it correctly with legs being damaged, destroyed and the 'mech still viable ( albeit on the ground) was Kesmai's  MultiPlayer Battletech.
On that game people still legged but that didn't stop their opponent from possibly standing on one leg  or propping with ausable arc of fire.
Well it would be cool if this mod could follow that lead, legging to disable but head or torso shots for the kill
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« Reply #10 on: October 24, 2008, 08:16:46 PM »

Most 'mech video games took the damage model straight from the tabletop.
The only game I know of that did it correctly with legs being damaged, destroyed and the 'mech still viable ( albeit on the ground) was Kesmai's  MultiPlayer Battletech.
On that game people still legged but that didn't stop their opponent from possibly standing on one leg  or propping with ausable arc of fire.
Well it would be cool if this mod could follow that lead, legging to disable but head or torso shots for the kill

kind of .. unrealistic don't you think?

I mean if the mech has 4 legs and you take 1 out.. I can still see it walking.

But 2-1 = on the ground.  Maybe you should still be able to shoot but you would be pretty much done for.
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DruidChiken
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« Reply #11 on: October 25, 2008, 03:21:50 PM »

A destroyed leg doesnt necessarily mean it has to be missing the animations and practicality of modelling that may be too great but, 2 critted (destroyed) legs means that the mech would be unable to move, it is then a standing turret.

It will always be a viable tactic to leg mechs, but in order to kill them then critical body areas should need to be destroyed, after all these are walking tanks and in the real world you cant kill a tank just by blowing its tracks off, why should a mech be any different
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« Reply #12 on: October 25, 2008, 03:48:48 PM »

Neg! It can´t become a standing turret, that the Torso has to have some sort of fully functionally gyro to turn. I will go so far as to say, that one of the arms is still operational, but still the recoil alone, would shift the balance of the remaing part of the `Mech, and so only a very brave Pilot would willing await the unavoidable (see infra). And a ´Mech that has been cut of from its legs, may it be the one or both legs (on a bipedal), very rarely falls in a position that enables it to retaliate fire. It will most likely tip towards its heaviest armored side. Not to say that the damage sustained from the crash, makes it that more a near suicidal option to continiue fighting in it. Any pilot with a tiny sence of survival in him, would eject before it crashed, mainly to escape the fact of becomming capture in the unit, but surely also to limit the exposure of an eventual breach in the fusion reactor, that would flood the ´Mech and its surrounding with deadly rads.
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Zeus6S
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« Reply #13 on: October 25, 2008, 04:40:43 PM »

As in CBT, knocking a mech down would generally cause injury to the pilot, potentially knocking them unconscious.

But yeah, once a mech loses a leg it is pretty much eliminated. It can prop itself up on one arm (assuming it still has both of them) and fire one arm at the enemy, but the torso weapons are generally unable to pivot into position to fire. The mech is an easy target and can only bring a small portion of its weapons to bear (unless it's a clan mech, then it's all arm mounted anyway.)

Realistically the legs are the guaranteed method of killing a walker. Something that large falling over would cause incredible damage to itself and the pilot would probably get a hell of a concussion from the impact. After that it is a sitting duck.

What I'm really tired of is players b*tching about how legging is cheap. What was cheap about it was MW4 had the damage transfer from a destroyed leg into the leg next to it, that isn't how it works in CBT, the damage transfers to the ajoined torso location, so blasting into someone's leg actually took 2-3 times the amount of firepower than simply blasting in the torso for a clean kill.

Of course, if you strip your leg armor and I fire a ppc shot at it and see it turn orange, you can bet I'm going to exploit your decision to get a few extra weapons or heat sinks.
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Jhereg
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« Reply #14 on: October 26, 2008, 12:11:32 AM »


Most 'mech video games took the damage model straight from the tabletop.
The only game I know of that did it correctly with legs being damaged, destroyed and the 'mech still viable ( albeit on the ground) was Kesmai's  MultiPlayer Battletech.
On that game people still legged but that didn't stop their opponent from possibly standing on one leg  or propping with ausable arc of fire.
Well it would be cool if this mod could follow that lead, legging to disable but head or torso shots for the kill
Quote

kind of .. unrealistic don't you think?

I mean if the mech has 4 legs and you take 1 out.. I can still see it walking.

But 2-1 = on the ground.  Maybe you should still be able to shoot but you would be pretty much done for.


I never stated that they could walk with one leg totally destroyed, it shouldn't hop  Grin

A heavily damaged leg would give reduced movement and the animation would have the 'mech drag the leg, looked pretty damned cool.
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